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 Post subject: A question for Boyd...or someone who can answer, RE: taping.Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2003 3:13 pm 
Does Eisley have a taping policy? I was thinking of how great it would be to say to someone, "the record's amazing, but listen to them live." and burn them a show. This is a great way to spread a fanbase and get people really into the band... no offense at ALL, but the studio does the band little justice, they're such a great live act. that said, rock. _________________ knives don't have your back. |
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Joined: 07 Jun 2003 | Posts: 980 | Location: Los Angeles
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2003 4:48 pm
Yes, i could use some Eisley DAT masters in my collection (to be shared to all, of course) 
Heres some good resourses to check out regarding the whole taping/distrobution hobby: http://www.oade.com (technobabble) http://www.taperssection.com (more technobabble) http://www.etree.org (online distrobution technique) http://www.phishhook.com (interactive snail mail trading community) http://www.archive.org/audio (live music archival project) 
String Cheese Incident On The Rocks 9/5/03 _________________ I can't find an icon 
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Joined: 09 Jun 2003 | Posts: 271 | Location: Phoenix, AZ -> Flagstaff, AZ -> Limerick, Ireland (soon)
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Post subject: taping Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2003 5:09 pm
Jay, hey. here's some songs, just in case you hadn't heard it. I posted this today...live from Toronto - out with Coldplay. It was, admittedly their least favorite show, but the song is ok...Marvelous Things is from Boise, I think...just raw, live footage: http://www.eisley.com/test/theyallsurroundedus(128k).mp3 http://www.eisley.com/test/marvelous.ram by the way...I have had an open policy on taping thus far...but I'm starting to understand why labels say don't allow taping; people get the suckiest stuff possible and put it on line... then others hear it and think: this band has a suck factor of 206%. I dunno. Here's another issue: videorecordings are the most unforgiving of all media... I know this from having videotaped eisley shows forever; the show seems great and the sound is good....but the videotape is depressing. All bands say this. I'm not sure what I think...I might have to think some more about it. We're very accessible and it's not a greedy posture... certainly no problem in that area. If I could insure that the quality of the tape based on the performance level was "there", then certainly....tape it. But quality control seems to be more and more an issue these days. Someone taped Waterloo and posted it on this forum. yikes. It was terrible... I'm not sure at that point - it doesn't hurt the band. The quality was very lame, so it affected what you heard from the band. hmmm... _________________ EisleyWebGuy "The industrialists never saw the fruit of their own labor - Post Moderism, which I now proclaim as dead. Their forefathers digital revolutionists, have accelerated the final resolve by punctuating an end to our chaotic journey with a new manifesto and a new era: The Age of Meaning." (manifesto's sold separate) Welcome: Illuminists |
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Joined: 04 Nov 2002 | Posts: 5180 | Location: Tyler, Texas
Last edited by boyd on Fri Sep 12, 2003 7:56 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2003 5:18 pm
i'm all for aud taping...pulling with good mics or something...but i've heard some terrible recordings. TERRIBLE. i've also heard some great ones. what about getting a soundboard patch to my iBook? (i've got a usb sound adapter so i can line in from the board). that's how i record most the gigs i do (no real big name bands...although i taped a tim reynolds and greg howard show...which was absolutely amazing). just get the raw tracks in .wav or .aiff on there and mix accordingly. no better quality than that you know? i mean...soundboard patches arent always the best...but if you get the very end of the line, as to waht comes through the PA...it's generally acceptable with some softening. i'm just curious because if you're heading to colorado anytime soon, i'd love to record. soundboard, or otherwise with some really good mic placement... forgive me, i'm a total geek for this stuff (engineering, performing and producing studio and live, live show photography...the kind of stuff just gets me all...well you seem to know all about it.) anyway. thanks for the prompt response.
peace. _________________ knives don't have your back. |
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Joined: 07 Jun 2003 | Posts: 980 | Location: Los Angeles
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Post subject: thoughts Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2003 5:36 pm
Been talking to Dan all day about stuff... he has over 150 Coldplay shows off the board; well, that is - they do; the band does, but Dan is their most trusted guy...been with Coldplay since before they were named Coldplay. (earlier was Starfish) The thing about taping off the board is...he feels the band should control what happens with those recordings. You can make a b-sides if you have enough performances; or you can flood the market with your own bootlegs; but the point is - you can insure quality control; Some stuff shouldn't be realeased. I want to talk more to management about this topic before I weigh in. But thanks. And I don't know when or if eisely will be back in Colorodo. If you guys want them back, someone might should bombard Little Big Man... getting so sleepy, I can'st stay awake. gotta get up early. studio. bd _________________ EisleyWebGuy "The industrialists never saw the fruit of their own labor - Post Moderism, which I now proclaim as dead. Their forefathers digital revolutionists, have accelerated the final resolve by punctuating an end to our chaotic journey with a new manifesto and a new era: The Age of Meaning." (manifesto's sold separate) Welcome: Illuminists |
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Joined: 04 Nov 2002 | Posts: 5180 | Location: Tyler, Texas
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2003 5:55 pm
I've always had that philosophy about the quality. That's why I believed the much maligned Lars Ulrich when he talked all about that during the Napster debacle. (I don't want to start that, though ... PLEASE don't talk about Lars ... I don't want to be a firestarter.) Personally, I'd record the show, keep it all for myself, and share the real gems with friends to convert them. But if we all followed the rules, things would be a lot different in the world ... _________________ My photography:www.jamiemphoto.com You can't spell awesome without emo...backwards! -Julie definingawesome (11:44:11 PM): Eisley shivers our timbers |
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Joined: 15 Aug 2003 | Posts: 25185 | Location: East Texas
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2003 8:00 pm
Boyd- Good tapers take their recordings VERY seriously in terms of quality control. These types of tapers are the ones that are attracted to bands with open taping policies and bands that are generally pumped to have their music spread in such a manner. On the other side of the spectrum, there are the bootleggers. Unfortunatly the bootleggers will always be around (open to taping or not) with their good or bad recordings, spreading them in an inadequate form (mp3s, outdated media, for profit on ebay just to name a few examples). You cant avoid the "bootlegger", but giving access to the people who are willing to make EXTREMELY high quality recordings can be very beneficial, in terms of both getting your music heard and quality control. If you give people the means to make quality tapes, such as an open/advertised policy, they WILL come with their mics, stands and DAT recorders! In the same respect, we take alot of pride in the work we do. It is a SERIOUS hobby (the pricetags on our gear is proof), therefore we make sure that our end product is adequate for the ears of the listeners who's decision to see your next show is being based on how they perceive your music to sound live. The folks over at etree and the internet archive are extremely meticulous on tape quality in regards to the tape quality itself, the conversion or the tape into a lossless format for archival purpose, and how it is spread to listeners. Allowing technogeeks to come into your shows with mic stands and field recorders is probably not at the top of your concerns seeing as how fast things are changing for you all, but i thought i'd chime in since this is a area of "expertise" for me. I have over 500 shows on CD-R, DAT Tape, cassete tape, and hard drive combined. I keep a somewhat updated list of my recordings here: http://www.phishhook.com/lists/tmdrums17 I can send samples of anything off that list, plus a bunch of stuff i've been too slow to list now that shcool has started. That list has everything form bluegrass to world music, sources ranging from soundboards to fingernail sized microphones placed in a hat and run into a minidisc recorder. Oh, and to the guy with the Lars comment, heres a little known fact: From the early 90's all the way to their North American Fall tour in 1998 (when all the Napster stuff started going down), Metallica accually sold a limited ammount of special tickets to tapers so that they could bring in full blown taping rigs and tape form a special section where they wouldent be bothered by other fans (usually directly behind the soundboard). Fans were also allowed to trade the recordings on a not-for-profit basis. So, to say that Lars and the gang had a problem with their live recordings being spread isnt true, though such benifits were stripped once people started sharing the material that the band was supposed to be making a living off of;) _________________ I can't find an icon
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Joined: 09 Jun 2003 | Posts: 271 | Location: Phoenix, AZ -> Flagstaff, AZ -> Limerick, Ireland (soon)
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Sep 12, 2003 2:37 am
tmdrums17 wrote: Oh, and to the guy with the Lars comment, heres a little known fact: Cool. I'm not the least bit surpised. Anyone who really knows much at all about Metallica knows how much they try to please their fans. Eisley could always release a kajillion live albums like Pearl Jam ... har har. _________________ My photography:www.jamiemphoto.com You can't spell awesome without emo...backwards! -Julie definingawesome (11:44:11 PM): Eisley shivers our timbers |
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Joined: 15 Aug 2003 | Posts: 25185 | Location: East Texas
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Sep 12, 2003 3:25 am
Uh.... maybe ban cameras and photographers too. I mean 'cause they may take an unflattering picture. I think tmdrums17 has a point. Control the quality by controlling recording personell. That way you can appease fans and those who want to hear the real band (not an over produced sound from an engineering booth). Don't get me wrong, I love the albums so far, but live material IS gritty, and that's why people like it. Everyone seeing/hearing those recordings knows the quality is gonna be less than perfect. But they wanna see what's real. What is the band really like? These kind of recordings give those glimpses. I'll take a punch at you Boyd, 'cause I can. There is just a tad bit of elitism sneeking in here. Is there not enough really good stuff out there from the band to counter any crap that might sneek out? Maybe the band is so bad live, you don't think they'll do well on bootleg video? (I've seen them live and that's not true) Do you think the band can't handle it? And your B-sides comment sounds like it's all about the money. and I know that's not you. Maybe you think nobody can control the quality but the band and the label? I think there's a balance to be struck here, between quality (which is important) and accessiblity. I think this issue goes to the heart of Eisley's brand. They are open. They are accessible and I hope that never ends. I know the band is growing and evolving, and and all this complete openess will vanish, but hold on to all you can while you can. Take council from those who've been there, like Dan, but do what's right for the band. Dance wit' da one what brung ya! Your fans. Wow! Sorry! this really got under my skin. I've talked way too much about what I know nothing of. Just some thoughts. Don't hate me Boyd. But you can if you want, I will. (hate me that is) jay _________________ So there I go, Without my no. Only a yes And passive aggressiveness. |
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Joined: 10 Apr 2003 | Posts: 313 | Location: Tyler, Texas
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Sep 12, 2003 1:57 pm
i dont think there's any amount of elitism. it's a matter of controlling what a band, a band that is his family...the band he manages and represents - is presented in a light that isnt bad or unflattering. i understand his point of view completely. i've had more than a few gigs where no amount of hot tea could fix the fact that my voice sounded like a combination of liam gallagher, shards of broken glass, and a lawn mower. i've got a few iem (in ear monitor) recordings from some gigs that the band i was in that are just absolutely horrid...we sound completely shited. i've seen pictures and video of myself that i'd never wish to share with anyone. it is about quality control. and i think if we can tape, we just have to get the best possible pull, or best possible video (if video is to be done). trading and sharing of live shows can be a great thing and a terrible thing. **Boyd** as far as the recording direct from the board goes, i know how that can go awry. early on the dave matthews band had a completely open policy...audio, video and soundboard patches available. that all changed when greedy, worthless scum of people started selling these recordings in record stores. these days with e-bay...it's absolutely mad. i was at a Radiohead show in camden, nj last month. and saw a few tapers...hoping they'd be the type that release the sources and let everyone relive it like it should be...i was wrong. so far, one person has released a show, without encores because he had to leave...i commend that guy. another has put it on e-bay...which is absolutely ridiculous. ok now i'm just ranting, so i'm done, heh. thanks boyd, seriously...for your time to discuss the subject. _________________ knives don't have your back. |
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Joined: 07 Jun 2003 | Posts: 980 | Location: Los Angeles
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Sep 12, 2003 6:56 pm
Jay- Shame to hear about the Camden situation. I for one look forward to pulling one heck of a tape from FOB at Chula Vista. Time to get this Nomad JB3 a rockin (DPA 4060>AD20>Nomad JB3 FOB DFC). Sorry for the thread hijack;) _________________ I can't find an icon
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Joined: 09 Jun 2003 | Posts: 271 | Location: Phoenix, AZ -> Flagstaff, AZ -> Limerick, Ireland (soon)
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Post subject: Re: taping Posted: Fri Sep 12, 2003 8:46 pm
boyd wrote: I'm not sure what I think...I might have to think some more about it. We're very accessible and it's not a greedy posture... certainly no problem in that area. If I could insure that the quality of the tape based on the performance level was "there", then certainly....tape it. But quality control seems to be more and more an issue these days. It seems like I spoke very clearly about the issues diddlebaum has brought up...quite literally. My initial response to this question merely reflects a pause - as I'm trying to sort this all out. Actually this discussion is very informative. And really, my reaction was based on hearing that Waterloo tape... trying to imagine what new fans and or even ones that had never heard the band would think. So, naturally, it was alarming. My philosophy has always been - give it away... spread the love... I just never imagined, in my naiivity that the end-result of such thinking might: spread the poop instead. That has little to do with elitism or greed. (  I'll diddleBOMB you !!! )
However, and in spite of my fears, the quality-minded technoids win my respect... perhaps I'll have a talk with friends at the label and mangagement who have a depth of experience and would give me some additional straight talk. I do trust the Coldplay guys very much - as they are balanced, normal, thankful, genuine folk. Dan, their close friend shed some light on this subject, but none of it's conclusive. In closing, I have to say that it's very cool that you guys are wanting to capture the band live. Thanks. It's 3:40am...I just picked the band up from working with Dan on pre-production; omgosh...the good vibe was contagious. Goodnightall. P.S. sorry all; i can talk to diddle-little that way...he's my man slave and I can put strictnein in his coffee to get even if he ever disagree's with me EVER again. Cuz, people...he KNOWS better. (fake smiley) _________________ EisleyWebGuy "The industrialists never saw the fruit of their own labor - Post Moderism, which I now proclaim as dead. Their forefathers digital revolutionists, have accelerated the final resolve by punctuating an end to our chaotic journey with a new manifesto and a new era: The Age of Meaning." (manifesto's sold separate) Welcome: Illuminists |
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Joined: 04 Nov 2002 | Posts: 5180 | Location: Tyler, Texas
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Post subject: Re: taping Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2003 1:17 am
[quote="boyd"] boyd wrote: P.S. sorry all; i can talk to diddle-little that way...he's my man slave and I can put strictnein in his coffee to get even if he ever disagree's with me EVER again. Cuz, people...he KNOWS better. (fake smiley) elitism at it's highest. a real texan would just club to dead me while i mixed cream in my coffee. uh....when is coffe btw.  _________________ So there I go, Without my no. Only a yes And passive aggressiveness. |
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Joined: 10 Apr 2003 | Posts: 313 | Location: Tyler, Texas
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2003 1:29 am
you put cream in your coffee?... that ruins it! |
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Joined: 18 Apr 2003 | Posts: 3939 | Location: here
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2003 3:51 am
Only to hide the taste of the stictnine (sp?) 
jay _________________ So there I go, Without my no. Only a yes And passive aggressiveness. |
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Joined: 10 Apr 2003 | Posts: 313 | Location: Tyler, Texas
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Laughing City Forum Index -> eisleyBlog -> A question for Boyd...or someone who can answer, RE: taping.
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