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Are you a midnight (or any other time) toker?
Marijuana smoke has never entered my lungs.
38%
 38%  [ 10 ]
I've tried it once or twice.
23%
 23%  [ 6 ]
I used to, but not anymore.
15%
 15%  [ 4 ]
I'm an occasional social smoker.
23%
 23%  [ 6 ]
Total Votes : 26

Author Message
olimario
Laughing Citizen


Well, anything can be addictive because choices create a physiological response in the brain. Addiction needs to be treated mentally and physically. I put both of those fields under the broad banner of "medical issues".

Addiction can't be effectively treated with punishment.
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wilsmith
Vintage Newbie


Fair enough, I made pretty much the same point in agreeing with Inorbit, but who should bare the cost for treatment? Those costs are in a sense punitive damages that some entity is going to get stuck with as a result of potentially addictive indulgences that can take a turn towards destructive to a person's health and/ or social productivity.

How should insurers deal with users/ abusers of drugs? Like they do smokers? Will weed heads just lie to keep their insurance rates down? Isn't that fraud and subject to termination of said policy? You get caught in one vicious cycle or another from what I can tell.

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Last edited by wilsmith on Thu Aug 25, 2011 4:45 am; edited 1 time in total
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olimario
Laughing Citizen


Nix the DEA
Keeps non-violent drug offenders out of jail
Tax marijuana


you'll have more than enough money for treatment
but even then, I hate programs like that
personally i would want the family to pay for such treatments
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mr pine
Vintage Newbie


wow this is a momentous occation.

olimario and i are agreeing on something.


lets all go smoke a bowl and have a nice big steak!!!!!

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tahruh
Vintage Newbie


wilsmith wrote:
Fair enough, but who should bare the cost for treatment? Those costs are in a sense punitive damages that some entity is going to get stuck with as a result of potentially addictive indulgences that can take a turn towards destructive to a person's health and/ or social productivity.
Who do you think pays for prisons?

Some prison facts: http://core.ecu.edu/soci/juskaa/SOCI2110/Prison_Industrial_Complex.htm

And in this post-W world, those statistics are extremely outdated (i.e., things have gotten worse).

And how about Type 2 Diabetes? Or most diseases that are the result of poor dietary and lifestyle choices? These people warrant medical and (potentially) psychological intervention, right?

Also, Pine really wants to get stoned! Laughing
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mr pine
Vintage Newbie


this is some good stuff man



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Cendrillon
Golly, Poster


Quote:
Cendrillion - I didn't have my first drink until I was 22. A friend from Spain and I had debate class together, and in practicing for our debate, we had dinner, and he insisted we have wine with our meal, as it was customary, and that was my first drink.

But there are some places where Communion is taken with wine, not grape juice, so are we talking drinking alcohol period or drinking for effect?


Oh, I've had wine at church, definitely. I'm Catholic, so I think that's all they ever have? But I don't like it. And I've had small bits of alcohol with my parents. Not a fan. Sometimes I make fondue with beer in it, haha. That's about as wild as I get.

I guess I feel like...why would I want to put something in my body that is either a. illegal b. mind altering c. expensive d. laden with empty calories or d. all of the above? I've got enough potential health problems without that stuff.

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Saellys
Vintage Newbie


I tried it once last year. It did nothing for me, needless to say, and I don't intend to ever try it again. Happily, I do not seem to have an addictive personality when it comes to any form of smoking--I do love a Djarum now and then (though not in the past seven months, obviously) but it never got under my skin.

Pot smoke is one of two things I can actually smell, and it drives me up a wall. I probably wouldn't find it so unpleasant if I didn't associate it with a jackass I dated for a couple weeks and some people I knew in Tennessee. Stereotypical stoners, the lot of them: getting high, playing video games, and talking about how cool it would be if they formed bands together or went on road trips (which would require them not spending their wages on weed every two weeks). A million plans, and not one iota of initiative. If I ever did partake again, I can see myself easily falling into that.

That being said, I do not begrudge anyone else the right to smoke, and I believe it should be legalized.

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wilsmith
Vintage Newbie


Ouroboros



I have a thing against self-perpetuating cycles of non-gratification and escalating intensity. The logic of Social, let along Biological Darwinism says the support and practice of such institutions will result in extinction.

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tahruh
Vintage Newbie


Cannabis isn't a gateway drug.

And it's been around for a very long time; so have other naturally occurring hallucinogens. There has always been a spiritual and practical significance to them. Plus, those apes we evolved from were and still are totally into mother nature's highs!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1366327/Apes-were-first-to-g et-high-on-drugs.html
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wilsmith
Vintage Newbie


I addressed that earlier, just cause it's out there in nature doesn't mean it does you well to imbibe it. It doesn't make it right for someone to persuade you to imbibe with the promise of some augmentative result you're supposed to come to prefer.

tahruh wrote:
wilsmith wrote:
Fair enough, but who should bare the cost for treatment? Those costs are in a sense punitive damages that some entity is going to get stuck with as a result of potentially addictive indulgences that can take a turn towards destructive to a person's health and/ or social productivity.
Who do you think pays for prisons?

Some prison facts: http://core.ecu.edu/soci/juskaa/SOCI2110/Prison_Industrial_Complex.htm

And in this post-W world, those statistics are extremely outdated (i.e., things have gotten worse).

And how about Type 2 Diabetes? Or most diseases that are the result of poor dietary and lifestyle choices? These people warrant medical and (potentially) psychological intervention, right?


^refer to previous Ouroboros post and extrapolate to everything you mention and anything else you can imagine. Evil Wil aka Wil O'reilly Twisted Evil is a totalitarian. He sees things from a Structural Functionalist View Point with Utilitarian aims by High Moral Standards. He sticks to radical overarching principles.

The ideal prison houses threats to society and civility. My ideal prison would constitute slave labor to some with only basic human needs being met. They will provide for themselves or they would suffer the manifest deficiencies of someone not willing to fend for themselves in the outside world.

There wouldn't be a sector of the economy that institutionalized itself like there is now. I'm not stupid. I may be a fence sitter, but trust me, if I am angling on an issue like this, my Altruistic proclamations are sweeping. I am hardcore. It would be straight edge, start trek, vegan utopia if Wil O'reilly had his way.

For those who want to live otherwise, feel free, elsewhere. Don't come for what we have or we will destroy you. We are happy as we are, leave us be. It was your choice to deviate and leave.

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olimario
Laughing Citizen


Cendrillon wrote:
Quote:
Cendrillion - I didn't have my first drink until I was 22. A friend from Spain and I had debate class together, and in practicing for our debate, we had dinner, and he insisted we have wine with our meal, as it was customary, and that was my first drink.

But there are some places where Communion is taken with wine, not grape juice, so are we talking drinking alcohol period or drinking for effect?


Oh, I've had wine at church, definitely. I'm Catholic, so I think that's all they ever have? But I don't like it. And I've had small bits of alcohol with my parents. Not a fan. Sometimes I make fondue with beer in it, haha. That's about as wild as I get.

I guess I feel like...why would I want to put something in my body that is either a. illegal b. mind altering c. expensive d. laden with empty calories or d. all of the above? I've got enough potential health problems without that stuff.


You have to question motives behind the legality of stuff. Hemp is an amazing and versatile crop that has been demonized for decades.

And other than the ill effects of particle inhalation, casual marijuana use can be good for you. Kind of like a daily glass of red win.
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mr pine
Vintage Newbie


Cendrillon wrote:
Oh, I've had wine at church, definitely. I'm Catholic, .


That's not wine. That's the blood of Christ. Get it right! Some Catholic you are.
Unless you are talking about outside of church. Then it is wine.

Seriously I am really hepped up on monster right now and for whatever reason that, to me, that is the cleverest thing I have ever written

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guitarfreak217
Vintage Newbie


I have never smoked it. Don't ever intend to smoke it. Doesn't appeal to me, even though I am an occasional partaker of pipe tobacco.

That said, I am 100% for the legalisation of marijuana. Especially for medicinal purposes, but honestly, if it's regulated and everything, it just works out better for everybody.

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wilsmith
Vintage Newbie


mr pine wrote:
Cendrillon wrote:
Oh, I've had wine at church, definitely. I'm Catholic, .


That's not wine. That's the blood of Christ. Get it right! Some Catholic you are.
Unless you are talking about outside of church. Then it is wine.

Seriously I am really hepped up on monster right now and for whatever reason that, to me, that is the cleverest thing I have ever written


That made me laugh, but I went to particularly chatty and contentious Churches of Christ for the last 8 years off and on, so it's in my wheel house of "Things a Smart Alek COC member might say." for $500. Laughing

Oh Catholicism, can't live with it, can't thoroughly undermine the moral authority of Christianity throughout history without it.

Back to Hemp. You would wonder why Monsanto or some other agricultural firm has engineered a Hemp plant that doesn't produce the chemicals responsible for the high? If they did that, then there goes half the argument against legalization. The other half is rendered null and void with the engineering out of the medicinal part (which I'm sure exists in synthetic legal forms under various names already anyway.) Hemp that makes you well, works as a useful fiber, but doesn't get anyone high, I'm sure everyone could get behind that, including big money, if they are allowed to patent the seed, oh and repatriate the seed said crop produces at the end of the harvest like they do with their insect resistant corn seed etc.

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